034. Retiring Without Losing Your Sense of Purpose: Jim Burneka's Journey [Part 2]

Welcome back to Part 2 of our  series with Jim Burneka! Today dive deeper into Jim's unwavering commitment to firefighter health and wellness. We explore his advocacy and insights that have transformed the firefighting community.

🔥 Follow along on Jim's remarkable journey. Learn about his tireless efforts to prevent occupational cancer among firefighters. He speaks about  his passion for change, and explains how he's helped firefighters far beyond his own department.

🌟 Find out more about Brothers Helping Brothers, the organization that Jim founded. Brothers Helping Brothers continues to blaze a trail in supporting firefighters' well-being. We also explore how peer support teams are evolving. And how they are making an impact on the mental resilience of those who serve our communities.

🤝 Jim's experiences shed light on the power of community and the importance of mental health awareness. Discover how he's breaking down barriers and fostering a culture of support and understanding.

🧠 Mental health remains a central theme in this episode. Jim shares essential insights on the steps firefighters can take to prioritize their mental well-being and how we can collectively work to end the stigma around seeking help.

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Transcript

TJ: So let's touch back on, let's go back a little bit. Rewind to, to cancer. Talk to me about Firefighter Cancer Consultants. I. You've been all over the place. Is it safe to say sharing your story,

Jim: Um,

TJ: educating all of the above, enacting change, what is it that you're, you know, bebopping around throughout the world 

Jim: you know, um. So when I got kicked out of FCSN, um, I, I really thought I, I had, I mean, there's options out there. There's other, there's another cancer group that I, that I probably could have joined. Um, but I just, when it all came down to it, it was, um, I kind of wanted to be my own boss. 'cause at least that way, um, nobody's going to fire me or kick me out. So, so it was almost in, in, in regard to that. But at the same time, I like, so I should say too, so before I did that, and, and it's weird to when you, when you really think back and you realize that things that may have at the time seemed like it sucked, actually helped out later on and. I'll give you the example is I, uh, I, I tore my ACL, which, and I've done that three times.

Um, but I tore my ACL I'm on light duty at work and I ask, you know, if I asked the district chief at that time, if I could just focus on doing cancer prevention stuff instead of the usually mundane, you know, light didi rolls of paperwork and errands and all that kind of stuff. Like, let me actually do something I care about.

And, and so just by doing that and really, you know, was, was the inception and I didn't realize it at the time of what I was gonna be doing next, and actually being able to do the same thing for other departments. So I think the other thing is when I, when I did stuff with the Firefighter Cancer Sport Network, it was, I mean, it was great, but it was, it was so.

Um, just the magnitude of, of what we were talking about it, it got out there, but it was, it was all very generic. It was like, these are the roles that you, you know, the, like we did the F-C-S-M-Y paper in 2013 and it had like, the 11 steps prevent cancer, and it was, those were great, but they were all very generic.

So it, it may not, you know, what's in Howard would not be the same for Dayton and everything else. So the idea was with the Firefighter Cancer consultants was to actually get in, get in grossed in that individual department, figure out what they do on a fire scene and also back at the firehouse regarding all these cancer items, and really give them this report and this presentation that that's just shares their current practices compared to the best practices for reducing firefighter cancer.

So. You know, all that stuff is based off of NFPA standards and different science that's out there. You know, so they know that I'm not just making stuff up and going, Hey, do this. Um, and, and it really just gives that department the opportunity to know where they stand and what they need to work on. You know, what's the low hanging fruit?

What are the items that they can implement right away that are low cost or just procedural or, and then they also have the, you know, the big ticket items, the, the capital items, um, sometimes that they have to get, whether it's an exhaust system or, or even just a logistically difficult items of something that like we all should be doing, but we suck at it.

And that's like, you know, wearing our SCBAs for overhaul. That's our biggest exposure we get. But yet most of us. A lot of times aren't wearing our mask. Yeah. Oh, it's all clear. Well, no it's not. So, um, actually, you know, just talking about that kind of stuff. So, um, initially when I would go out and teach, like I, I didn't have really the personal story that was involved.

Um, so a lot of times I played, I'm not sure if you've ever seen it before, but it's a tremendous video. It's, it's by the Boston guys and it's where the, we have the wall of all the, the firefighters that has succumb to cancer and they have their families talking. And it's just a super powerful video. Um, and it really brings it home.

It personalizes it, it talks about the big picture. And I know I already mentioned before that what's the point of doing this if we're just gonna. You know, retire and die because that's what happens. Cancer has a latency period of 10, 15, 20, 25 years before it shows up, you know, from our exposures. Um, and unlike I always, I also like to use the, you know, if we're at that fire and we throw up a, a ladder and we fall off that ladder and we break our ankle, it is very obvious when, how and where we broke our ankle.

But it's not that way of cancer. Like, I don't know how I got my cancer. I have no idea. I can guess, but I'm not really sure. So it's because of that we have to do everything we possibly can and just hope that we don't get cancer. But if we do, we hope that we catch in an earlier stage. So, um, and that's kind of what I do with, you know, all the departments now.

But instead of playing that Boston video, now that I have my own story, I, I share my own story. And, uh, so that kind of does the, the personalized portion of it. I'd rather not be part of this club and have to do that, but the fact that I am, and I'm doing okay, like I, I do feel like I caught my cancer. I caught it early.

I'm in a good place and that allows me to, to continue to share that message. And essentially it's, it's kind of like what I've realized my whole career to be is don't be like me. You know? That's kind of the gist of it, the summary. Uh, don't be like me. Learn from my mistakes. Don't, don't do these mistakes yourself.

Learn from my mistakes and be better because of that.

TJ: And that that goes into, I think, the goal that we have of leaving this place better than we found it. The stories are more poignant when they're personal. When I can grab that young firefighter and say, listen, you're about to make this mistake. This is how I know because I've made that mistake. I'm imploring you.

Don't do it. These are the consequences. This is what you're gonna be facing. Take this lesson from me. I paid for it in blood. And you don't have to pay anything if you just listen to me. And it's um, it's funny you mentioned the being not wanting to be part of the club. I've referred to that I. I don't wanna make this about me, but like, when it comes to, to line of duty deaths, I, I've told people that once that happens, you are part of a horrible, horrible club.

But that sort of helps amplify your voice. So it's, it's interesting, you, you and I think very similarly, and sometimes creepily use the same 

Jim: I mean, we're both pretty good looking, so we got that going for us too.

TJ: I mean, hell yeah. I just

Jim: For all those, for all those just listening and not watching it just, yeah. We are, we are handsome gentlemen.

TJ: rugged, handsome, stunning. Maybe, I mean, I can post a

Jim: little hairy. But

TJ: not where it counts. 'cause we're both balding. This is bullshit.

Jim: I have a great cap collection.

TJ: I don't think you were wearing, were you wearing a cap when you were here in dc? I don't think so. I don't think any of the space shuttle 

Jim: Oh, I don't think so. I had 'em in my, I had 'em in my bag. Um, I did just buy a hat rack. I mean, if that tells you my size of my

cap 

TJ: look at shoe fancy

Jim: I know.

TJ: Now is it baseball hats? Is it the little crush caps, is it, or is it a little bit of 

Jim: It's the little, um, the handicap kind of caps, the hip, hipster, uh, I, I'm just, I'm with the beard, the glasses, the caps. Like I just, I'm just really hoping for a pipe for Christmas at this point, and then my, my transformation will be complete.

TJ: I feel like you would be judging me for not drinking an obscure IPA. Like once you get the cap and the pipe, you are gonna be judging me for not drinking some like organic.

Jim: Yes.

TJ: Like vegan

Jim: I, I only eat cheeseburgers if they're over $20.

TJ: yo. I had up some burger joint when, when I was there for the conference and it was amazing. I forget what it was, but the eating, like the, the food in, in your area, money that, um, that pizza joint we hit up, like the, the whole group of us went to after, after, what was it? Like Thursday and I forget 

Jim: Pies and 

pines. Yeah. Yeah. I 

TJ: Pies and pints. and then

Jim: go ahead.

TJ: I was gonna say, and then we went to that, it's called the pub, I think it is, or, yeah, we, um, I thought the bartender was gonna kill us because Burns from Massachusetts sits down and asks for a Miller light bottle. And the bartender like I was nearby and I took some splash damage because the dagger she shot at him.

I was like, yo, I don't know her. I haven't said a word, but I kind of wanna leave because I feel attacked as well.

Jim: so, but think about even like you and I are and staff are at the Airspace Museum and just. The giddiness, the excitement that I had, and I think you shared it as well when we realized a Shake Shack was actually

part of that. 

TJ: Right. Genius business move.

Jim: Yes.

TJ: I felt like I was a kid again at the Air and Space Museum and then, oh, now I want burgers and a shake. This is, I feel like I'm, again, I feel like I'm a kid. I feel I'm so excited. Yeah. We need, I need to go back and do an eating tour of Dayton and exotic with the Triple X Beaver Creek, Ohio.

Even though the next conference is gonna be. Yeah, we gotta, you gotta figure out something for the exotic part of, of this, this next year's conference, but,

Jim: We're still gonna call it Exotic Beaver Creek. 'cause I think we, that, that name actually has recognition now and, uh. As silly as that sounds like people actually know, like, like that's how they say, they say Beaver Creek. You gonna Beaver Creek? You gonna Beaver Creek? I'll be at Beaver Creek. It's crazy.

But that's, that's how it is. So, and Xenia just doesn't have the same ring to it.

TJ: But Xenia does sound pretty freaking exotic.

Jim: everybody's like Xenia, like the Warrior Princess This

TJ: That's the first thing I thought. Scaly clad women with 

Jim: Lucy 

Lucy Lawless. 

TJ: uh, never forget. Um.

Jim: Oh God.

TJ: All right. Perfect. Perfect segue. Perfect segue, brothers, helping Brothers. What is, what is brothers helping brothers all about?

Jim: You know this. That's,

TJ: And if you say, brothers, helping brothers, I'm cancel. Like, I'm just stopping this right now.

Jim: it was funny 'cause uh, you know, our keynote this year, Frank Lieb. He, he actually calls it, uh, brothers Helping Brothers and sisters. Like he added in the sister part, which it should be. But, uh, I mean, this, this, that's, uh, Nick's baby, that's his nonprofit that he started after one of his fellow firefighter coworkers and ended up passing, um, from actually of all things the H one N one flew.

And, um, they started this organization with the idea of, uh, supplying, uh, rural fire departments with just supplies, you know, these volunteer places. I mean, they're scraping by. And that's, uh, Nick's friend who passed was like the guy who would grab everything and refurbish it and, and still try to be able to use it.

'cause you're just, you know, you, you just don't have the fund. So, uh, the idea behind Brothers Helping Brothers is really just helping those firefighters out with those rural departments. But, uh, another branch of that is kind of the educational, the training piece. Um. You know, Nick would tell you that he struggled, like they made him an officer at his department.

And, you know, it was, it was kind of like what I was telling you earlier with the, with the FCSN, like, uh, hey, you made it. Um, and he's like, what do I do? And they're like, uh, dude, what do you think you should do? There was no, there's no direction, there was no training. Like he, you know, all of a sudden now, and you get this as an officer, like you're responsible for people more than just you.

And they're, that's, that's, that's a lot. And so, um, Nick realized that the, the trainings that were out there were pretty costly and the department wasn't able to pay for him. So he had to come out of his own pocket for that. So when he did this, this conference, the idea was always like, let's do this and do this to where, you know, if departments pay for you, then fine.

Cool. Awesome. But like, we shouldn't have a price in which. Um, somebody can't come outta their own pocket and attend training and make themselves better. So, and we've been able to maintain that mindset throughout, and it's really the reason why we ended up moving things this year. Um, to stay at the same place we would've had to raise cost, and that wasn't, that was unacceptable for us.

So we found a place that, that gives us the freedom and allows us to maintain that, that low cost. I mean, 75 bucks for three days with who we're bringing. Like, there's nobody, and I mean, nobody that can touch that. It just isn't out there. And that's, I think, part of the reason, you know, a big part of that is Nick and I don't get paid anything.

We're, you know, suckers for that kind of stuff, but, um. You know, we, everything we get is just to keep the cost at a minimum so people can attend and they can attend it, um, and bring everything back to their department, but also just more than anything, just better themselves. Um, and that's, you know, this year will be our seventh year doing it.

I think we got the formula down. Um, I'm hoping that people will still follow us, even if we're in a different building. Uh, and we're able to go and it's, it's a weird vibe and you were there, like we cover heavy stuff. Um, but at the same time, there's, there's a lightness to it. I mean, I, I think it's because it's, it's just not stuffy.

We don't take ourselves seriously at all. Like, we usually actually have themes and then this coming year is gonna be, I think our, I think our favorite theme gonna be pro wrestling theme. 'cause Nick and I, I mean we're both, uh, adopt children basically. Uh, we still. Love pro wrestling. And so we we're kind of like, let's, let's put our two loves together and be over the top and be ridiculous.

Still have heaviness, but again, have fun as we do it for a affordable rate. And I'll shut up there and let you talk.

TJ: Why me? You're the guest here. Dude. When I went to register and I saw the cost, I'm like, there's no way this is a typo. Like there, this is 100% wrong that they're charging so little and so little for the quality of speakers. You would be hard pressed to find. I mean big names in the game, like I don't even know where to start.

Like I was fangirling over James Gearing 'cause the dude has been doing his podcast for Forever. And then Ben Vernon and then Brendan McDonough and I'm rubbing El, like Elijah Bowman. I'm sitting there and he's showing me his like super fancy badass non iPad tablet and we're geeking out about stickers and podcasts and film.

I'm looking around, I was like, dude, there's like nowhere else on earth where I would be surrounded by this quality of people without having to pay an arm and a leg. Like think of something as big as FDIC. Yeah, you're gonna be surrounded by those people, but it's not gonna be in such an intimate setting.

It, it felt. It was irreverent. It was fun. At some point you took the mic and you said, Hey, we're supposed to be doing X, Y, or Z, but fuck it, it's my conference. We're changing things up a bit. And I, that's when I was like, you know what? This is my crowd. Like this is, this is, these are my people. The fact that we can, the fact that they can change things on the fly and be uncaring about it and drop an F bomb in front, I'm like, yeah, this is not the stuffy crowds that, that have grown to hate.

And, uh, I forget where I was going. I mean, I was just, I, I had a lot of fun. I had, I had a great time with, um, with everything. The, um, we, oh God, we did that podcast where. I have to have a Class one podcasting with Nick and with Sean, because they kept slamming the table to make a point, and every time they did, the microphones would vibrate.

I'll listen to the audio, and I just wanted to like throw my headphones across the room. But all in all, it's just, it's um, it's a breath of fresh air. It covers, like you said, the heavy topics there. There were some, like Brenda Mcna, uh, I, I started, I started reliving a lot of things that I'm like, I need to walk away.

So there's, there are things that, that get covered that are, that are heavy and, um, but also you walk outside and, you know, you're talking to John from Rescue One and you're shooting the shit, or you just the, the photo booth stuff. I. I think I, I'm the reason it cost you guys so much, because I took hundreds and hundreds of pictures in that photo booth.

Just being an absolute lunatic. It's, it was, it's, it feels like a firehouse. It feels like you are learning stuff at a firehouse with your friends. I can't speak enough about, about the conference. I'm definitely fangirling and, um, yeah, maybe I think, you know what? Fuck it. I, I just give away a scholarship for a, um, a conference here in Frederick.

I'm gonna do the same thing for, for the, um, for your conference. I don't, maybe if they, if I can't afford to fly them, maybe I'll stuff 'em in my suitcase and bring 'em up. But I want people to, to go out there and experience

Jim: Hey, random stranger hop in the back. Let's, let's, let's go to Beaver Creek.

TJ: Let's go to exotic Beaver Creek. There's this year there's gonna be wrestling and there's gonna be horses. And if we're lucky, a white Bronco.

Jim: Yeah. Maybe could be. I don't know what AC ISS doing yet. He hasn't got back to me. You know, the, the second year we did the conference, I could tell you, I, I, for whatever reason, I, I, I had this attitude, and I think Nick still wants to beat me up for it, but I, I said, let's be professional, let's like show that we're, we're legitimate.

TJ: you high when?

Jim: I, yeah, I mean, probably, uh, regrets. I, I don't know. Like I, I just, for whatever reason I wanted to be compared to like an FDIC or a Firehouse Expo or fire Chiefs or whatever else. And, uh, and we, in that second year, like we wore suits and, and I mean, it just throughout the process I was like, this is dumb.

This is not me. I did not feel comfortable. And Nick definitely didn't feel comfortable. And I think we, when we met. That next week to go over everything and figure out what we're gonna do next year. It was very quickly like, all right, I'm sorry, that was a dumb thing. Let's never, ever, ever do that again. And, and so, and with that, so like, again, now it's super casual. We dress up however we want. And, um, and the rest of the conference, that whole attitude, we realized like it's, we're not trying to compete against these other big guys. We are different. We're the alternative. You know, um, when you, when you go to FDIC and, and I spoke at FDIC this year, like, you know, I'm part of the fire engineering world, like, but it's 35,000 people and.

You just, that intimacy is not there, you know, the opportunity to really talk to the instructors is it's just not there. And beyond that, it's super expensive. Uh, it's, it's expensive to buy a pass to, to see all the classes. It's expensive to stay there. I mean, 300 bucks a night for a, a hotel room in Indy.

Um, that's hard to do. And, and they also like, you know, the, I mean FDIC, fire engineering, all these places, like they are very tactic heavy and tactics have its place and that's fine, but that's not what we do. You know, we are, we are on the wellness track. And so what we've realized is the people that, that have the same mindset as us, that, that share, that kind of, they're, they're in the health and wellness world.

Like they make this voyage to exotic Beaver Creek, where it's not easy to get to. You know, it's not a big city. Um, most places if you're flying, you're, you're getting a layover somewhere. Um, but they, they make the trek. Um, 'cause I think they just realize, and, and again, these people come and come again each year because they realize the value.

It's, it's worth the money. It's worth their time. That's another thing, you know, whenever I go someplace, I wanna make sure it's worth my time. If I go away somewhere, it's creating a hardship at home. Um, you know, so it has to be worthwhile for, for the time and for the money. And so. I, I think we, we are able to check those boxes for people.

Like they realize they're gonna come here and they're gonna learn a lot. They're gonna have, they're gonna make great, uh, networking connections because again, we're all like-minded people. Um, and that's the thing in this whole business, like nobody has to necessarily come up with something. Like we all share stuff.

If you're, you know, I was a, a wellness coordinator for Dayton. Well, you know, at that last conference, there's the wellness coordinator for Cincinnati. There it is for Columbus. There's Indianapolis. Like, like we did really good at networking and, and sharing stuff. And, and also they were all my pho of friends.

Like everybody needs those pho of friends. And a and a good way to learn those pho of friends is by going to this conference. 'cause again, it's so, it's so intimate. Um,

TJ: Yeah, and the networking is easy. You, you go to big events, you go to,

Jim: I.

TJ: we keep talking about FDIC out here on my end. I mean, there's, there's all this stuff up and down the east coast. Um, firehouse used to be in Baltimore before things got little gangster and, and they had to leave. And trying to network there is impossible.

It is like, it, I, I feel like I am back in some sort of corporate America, like a life that I never wanted trying to do my elevator pitch like that's. Not my jam. I would rather again, sit there with Elijah Bowman and talk about burned and then talk about the tablet and geek out on stickers. Or you know, who was the guy from Orlando?

Jeff Orange. I think it was, um, again, a, a a guy that otherwise I would've had to have business cards and all this stuff. I'm like, Hey bro, um, here's some things I want to ask you about. Here's my story and let's chat. And it's just so, it's, it's chill. It's, it's so, it's chill. And again, you open up a can of worms that unfortunately we cannot delve into.

But I want to have you back to talk about peer teams and the whole peer environment. But also I'm gonna have you back to talk about your perspective. 'cause you said that anytime you go into any of these events, at any time you partake in these conferences, you go away. It wreaks havoc at home. That is something that we don't explore enough when it comes to the conference circuit, when it comes to doing stuff on a national and international level.

So this is my super shady way of hooking you in for a next episode. But before we get into,

Jim: better add a zero to my pay.

TJ: oh, absolutely. I mean, bro, I, I already gave you all the stickers, so I'm gonna have to come up with more KTP swag to send your way. That, or you know what? No, the, the trip to the International Spy Museum, next time you're up here, that's gonna be on me,

Jim: I'm game.

TJ: which, what we should do is the spy museum and then an escape room.

I feel like we'd have so much fun doing those 

Jim: But we do, we gotta do the spy room ahead of time in case we get any pointers. It gives us in a mindset,

TJ: that's yes. Yes. 100%. Be like, where'd you guys get C four? Like, oh, next door at the spy museum. We don't know if it works, but it might blow a wall.

Jim: it's just, we thought it was bubblegum.

TJ: I actually had that conversation with, uh, with one of the captains at work. He's like, I'm really Shay walking around the firehouse with my buddy Josh. And he's like, where did you guys get all those fireworks? And I'm holding them like, all guilt, like, definitely not in my locker.

Jim: Nice.

TJ: So, looking ahead, what are your, what are your goals for, for this crazy ride? I was gonna say in the realm of firefighting, in the realm of mental health, but just what are Jim's goals in the next, in the next few years?

Jim: Oh goodness. Um, you know, uh, this is another tangent, uh, but I think, I mean, when you retire, a lot of people lose their sense of purpose, and, and that is so important, like to not lose that, uh, and, and really just to, to pivot and, and do things differently, but still be relevant and still have that purpose.

Um, it's the ones that kind of retire, that don't do anything that, that a lot of times don't do well. They get lost in a bottle, they get depressed. All those runs finally show up. Um, and have issues dealing with it. So I am, I'm still trying to just have a purpose and still still give to, you know, the fire service.

Uh, but just, I just have, have accepted it's gonna be different than it was beforehand. Um, you know, and it's, a lot of this stuff is just maintaining what I've already been doing. Like, I still wanna do the consulting for the cancer stuff. I still wanna do the webcast, um, and just continue to get information out.

Um, the big biggest thing I've been working on is, is a book, uh, autobiography. Uh, with my, my sister. I've just basically since the boys, my boys and her kids started school back in August. Usually each morning we sit down on a Zoom and I just tell her stories and she just writes and we go back and forth and we've got, we've got really bo really good bones of that book.

Like we've got definitely the base, and I don't even know what draft we're on now, but it's, it's getting there, um, and getting that book out there with the idea of, again, kinda like what we mentioned earlier, uh, learn from my mistakes, don't make the same thing. Like it's, you know, to me it's a re it's still gonna be a resource guide even though it's essentially my story, but a lot of it is the don't do what I did kind of stuff.

Um, beyond that, uh, I know my application is in with the international, it'll be a peer support instructor. Um, unfortunately I missed the deadline this year, but. Hopefully I'll be considered next year and, and that'll be my getting out and about and, and teaching as well. Um, and just still just staying out there and, and beyond that, uh, I'm flexible.

Like I don't really know where I'm gonna go with all this stuff, and that's okay. Like I, I was such the guy that I had to know the next moves. I had to know like what direction I was going and, and I've really, I've let all that go and I've really let just things happen and happen naturally. And, uh, that is as hard as it was.

It's been, it's been great. Um, and so I'm, I'm busy, but I'm not swamped and I definitely can still prioritize things. Uh, and, and, and I, I, I joke, I tell everybody that the key to work-life balance. Is retiring. Uh, but that's, that has been, that has been true to me. You know, not having to do all that stuff in Dayton and just being able to focus on this other stuff.

And also having the ability, this is a big one, having the ability to say no, um, that is not something that I have been good at. And whenever you say yes to something, you really, you have to realize you're saying no to something. And, you know, that's, that's my buddy Dr. Donny talking there. Uh, who will be at our conference next year.

Uh, you could check it out@exoticbeavercreek.com. Shameless plug. I gotta get in in there. But no, I mean, I think, I think that's it. I'm just kind of rolling with things and I'm having fun and I, I finally could tell you I feel kind of back to myself. It's taken a long time, but, uh, I, I'm enjoying life again.

TJ: I have nothing to follow up to that. That was, that was solid.

Jim: Complete, complete bullshit, all of it.

TJ: Well, you're a good bullshitter then. 'cause you had me fooled. No, I like the part about, about saying no and reframing a yes as saying no to so many other things we can get caught up in the hustle and bustle of, of just improving and succeeding and doing projects and all of those things. Me included, I like, uh.

I'm a fan of starting businesses and like structuring them in my head and then a couple months later being like, oh no, why don't I have time? And everyone around me is like, seriously, you absolute moron. Because you couldn't say no to this stupid opportunity. You should have just said no. And like, prioritize your life.

And we know a lot of people who are the same way, who, um, who just burn out because they, they do so much. So I really like that bit. And yeah. Um, the, again, I, I have to have you back because you left me with more questions. That's a good guess. That's a, that's a, that gift that keeps on giving and not the kind of exotic gift that you get from anyway from gifts that keep on giving the question that I didn't put in the list.

What is the one failure that you cherish the most?

Jim: Oh, TJ. Shit, man. You're hitting me with a deep question though, I gotta think. Um hmm. What is the failure that I cherish the most? Uh.

TJ: Correct.

Jim: This, oh man, this is gonna sound bizarre, but, uh, probably getting cancer. Like, to me, I failed all the stuff I talked about, all the preventative measures that I preach about. It still wasn't enough to prevent me from getting cancer. And you can, you can label that as being naive. I didn't know when I started a lot of this stuff.

I learned it after, I've already had years of experience of doing things the wrong way. But, um, the fact that I did end up getting cancer really in a weird way, got my, got my shit together. Like, you, you, when you get diagnosed, you just end up, all of a sudden you're, you're finally able to focus and truly prioritize things. And I think I was running amuck beforehand, super busy. And, and a lot of my choices were not really in, in the grand scheme of things, the best choices to make. Uh, and I, and I'm, what I mean by that is just, you know, I mean, I wasn't doing anything bad, but just, I, I, I wasn't always putting my family first. I certainly wasn't putting myself first.

Um, and when you get that diagnosis, um, as much as it sucked and as much as you think you screwed up because you got it, like it was a matter of this is a second opportunity to get things right and you better make the, the best out of it. So yeah, as weird as that sounds, I think that even though it sucked at the time, I can look at it now and go, that made me ultimately better.​ 

TJ: Hey everybody, TJ here. I hope you enjoyed both of these episodes with Jim. He. Has turned out to be an awesome friend, a great source of wisdom. And has shown us time. And again, that he's, that force to be reckoned with when it comes to firefighter health and wellness. So hopefully this gave you a bit of insight into where he's come from. Where he's going and the amazing things that he's doing. 

And most importantly, I hope that it sort of lit a fire under you, too. Go to the health and wellness conference. And if you can't do that, To start taking those steps that you can add home within your department. Uh, to make life better for those who, who wear the uniform with you. So I'm thankful to Jim. 

This was an awesome time. We chat all the time. We bounce ideas off each other, and he's going to be back here. I'll be back at the conference. He he's gonna fast become one of those good friends of the show. Let's me want some admin stuff. As you know, at the end of every episode, we do a special shout out to our patrons who have pledged to be part of the online community. If this is your first time listening, the only community you, the whole point is to help build those resilient well-rounded firefighters to actually put our money where our mouth is. So you get our daily workout. 

Once a week, you get a sort of mindset, meditation mantra, It's a way to refocus and redirect your energies towards a successful. Weak. There's also an exclusive many podcasts where we share trainings, where we share upcoming events, where we talk about the fundraisers. 

We've given away money for scholarships, for a handful of conferences. Also given money to, um, Leno duty death, um, fundraisers. And basically anything that we would share the firehouse, but now this is an international level. You're going to find within the community. If you're interested, hit up, join, keep the promise.com. And you'll get all the deets there. 

Again, join, keep the promise.com. But without further ado, let's give a shout out to our most recent members. Shout out, goes to Neil from Jackson, Missouri. Clayton from Elizabeth Colorado. Justin from St. Robert, Missouri. And Evan from Glenn, Mississippi. You guys are awesome. Thank you so much for believing in what we do. 

Thank you for joining this amazing community. There is a lot of amazing things on the horizon. And I cannot wait to share them with you. I kind of have to play my cards close for the time being, because there was a lot of behind the scenes work going on, but 20, 24 is going to be incredible and we'll be able to do. He even greater things for the fire service as a whole. 

So Neil Clayton, Justin and Evan. Thank you so much for joining. Thank you, dear listener for taking the time to listen to this episode. To an end in two weeks for another episode. be good. Be safe. Bye-bye.