090. Leatherwork, Fitness & What Makes a Good Firefighter [Part 2]

A lot of firefighters know how to work hard. Fewer know how to build a life outside the firehouse without losing their edge.

In Part 2, Nick talks about how leatherworking turned from a hobby into a booming business, why craftsmanship matters to so many firefighters, and how he manages family, fitness, and side work during a season of pure survival. This one is about discipline, communication, identity, and what it really means to be a good firefighter and a good man.

What You’ll Learn:

• How a simple side hobby can become a real outlet for purpose, creativity, and growth
• Why clear communication matters just as much in business as it does in the firehouse
• How to train and maintain your fitness when life is chaotic and sleep is wrecked
• Why your home life is the foundation for everything else you do on the job
• What it means to focus on the basics and stop getting distracted by fire service nonsense

If you’re a firefighter who wants to build something meaningful outside the job while still showing up strong for your crew and your family, this one’s for you.

Transcript

TJ: What's up everybody? Welcome back to the Keep the Promise Podcast In part two of this conversation with my buddy Nick Lindsay, we shift gears a little bit and go into the other side of life, that life outside of the firehouse,

what started as messing around with leather has turned into a booming custom leather working business. And Nick talks about how craftsmanship, creativity, and a little bit of fire service obsession turned into something so much bigger than he expected. We also talk about balancing family work and side projects, how seasons of life can affect your training and fitness, and some bigger picture thoughts on what it really means to be a good firefighter and more importantly, a good man.

So if you enjoyed part one, you're definitely going to appreciate where this conversation goes next. Let's get into it.

TJ: What's been harder for you? Building that skill of leatherwork, of, basically like project management from beginning to end or actually building that customer base because now you're getting into business territory, into acquisition, into scaling, into all those things that almost seeing, I,

Nick: I mean the skill portion,

like if you get your skills down and you're putting out a quality product, customer base will then come. If that kind of, that makes sense. And like at this point, like I said, I had to close orders because there's just too many of them. And that hasn't been for me, marketing, that's just been from word of mouth of just knowing like what we can do on small, you know.

Five and a half by piece of leather.

TJ: It's a tiny canvas for sure.

So you do leather work. We know firefighters who are into woodworking, into, there's a guy that I know that makes fishing lures. And do you think that the fire service and like the fire service population as a whole is more wired for craftsmanship, for working, for having a unique artistic outlet?

Nick: I think maybe, I mean, not everybody. There's plenty of people that I've talked to that are like, you don't want want me to draw a stick fig? But maybe they just haven't found that medium that really agrees with how, you know, their, their brain works around their hands work. Uh, I think we enjoy being tactile and building things from the ground up.

And I could definitely see, I, I, you know, I'm not surprised that people are good in the firehouse with, woodworking or cabinetry even like some of these guys turn into in, in the trades like electrical, they run their wires and you see how diligent they are and how well they feed all that in it.

Art in its own, if you will, like being able to put some of those things and then it's clean work. And I, I think there's just this, you get to have to find kind of what, what medium suits you. I don't doubt by any stretch of imagination when someone were to find that in our line of work, that excel at it.

TJ: Is it therapeutic for you? Sitting at the shop and carving, cutting, stamping, painting? 

Nick: Uh, I, I guess, I mean, I've never been to therapy, so I don't know exactly what that would be like, but to be able to just find up being quiet some days, you know, I'm not always listening to music.

I'm always listening to a, a TV show. Some days it's just coming down and it's just nice to just, you know, have, have si and i, I guess when you, you come down, I've been down here, you know, eight, nine o'clock at night and suddenly I'm blinking at 1:00 AM and I'm like, oh, shoot. Like that, that went by in a flash.

But I guess being able to shut up from some of the other and do the carving and stuff like that would definitely constitute a form of therapy.

TJ: You have a super busy life between work and the kids and the family and leather working and trying to make moves at work, and I know you were hanging out with Eckard for a while and doing fire tactics. How do you balance it all?

Nick: You just gotta read the room, if you will, if it's a, if it's a bad day at home with the kids, there really shouldn't be anything going on, you know, in, in the shop that day. If, if you're picking up my, my drift, you know, you have, you have to find the time that works and something's always gonna suffer, whether, you know, on case it's certainly gonna be the leather.

I'm not putting anything up. Above my family. So if you're willing to stay late, stay up late or, or get up early. There's your time. You know, you have, you know, I've set my alarm for four 30 this morning, but it just didn't work out 'cause kids were up. So nothing got done this morning.

So we'll try again tonight. But you always have to make sure that you know your family and the ones that you love are taken care of before and anything else. 'cause that's, that's your.

TJ: We are So back, 

Nick: back to it.

TJ: I think I might have to go to Zoom because this, this platform has been giving me nothing but issues. I'll say, 

Nick: is it you or me? 

TJ: Probably a combination of you, me, and the platform. I mean, right now you, everything is looking phenomenal, so, 

Nick: okay, 

TJ: so we're saying that basically family trumps absolutely everything when it comes to balancing the things you do in life.

Nick: Yeah, absolutely. That's the homestead, you know, that's what you're coming home to every day. They're the people that are supporting. You gotta give them a hundred percent without a doubt.

TJ: Now, whether or not you like this label, you're an entrepreneur at this point, has this changed how you look at the fire service?

Nick: I wouldn't, not really, to be honest with you. It's just, being able to communicate with people better. 'Cause I'm, at the end of the day, I'm still selling a product, selling it to firemen. Five and a half by, you know, six inches, whatever the exact measure is, doesn't always have a bunch of room.

So when you have got it came in, like it's, I can do it, but it, the, they're not gonna be there. 'cause the way that the leather gets car, when the knife goes to it, it takes out, it doesn't take out a chunk of leather, but you're making a, a cut in that leather. So being able, like to communicate to the boys, to the brothers, let 'em know like, ah, I can do something like this.

I can get you close, kind of deal. I think it doesn't necessarily change my outlook on it, but just like it's shown how important communication is as a whole in, in, in my mind. 

TJ: Yeah, and you hit on exactly the point that I wa, that I wanted to go after is that entrepreneurship really exposes your own personal flaws and your own personal shortcomings, and it forces you to overcome them.

So in your mind, it makes sense. Five and a half by six inch canvas, you can only do so much. Now, if they tell you, I want a keystone and a shamrock and a truck across the top and a big 37 and a street sign at the bottom, immediately you're like, holy shit, dude. No. But now you have to communicate because now maybe you haven't done a good job of telling them we can only add two or three elements, or we can try to do that.

It's going to look like shit. And how do you put that out there so that they understand and you're not attacking them, you're not attacking their design. You're just saying, these are our constraints. This is what we can work with. Let's make something that works. 

Nick: I try to see, you know, what, what's important to them, what do they really want on there?

And then work up something in the ballpark, if you will. Kind of like, even I've, I've done things where I know that it's not gonna work, but I wanted them to see it so that I could better explain it to 'em. Like, Hey, like we can't, like I did the whole front and I'm like, look, you want the number behind this this character.

Like, it, it's not gonna work. 'cause the character takes up so much space that the number behind it, you're not gonna see it. What do you think about moving it off? Like, I've tried it left and right, I've tried it off center. It just doesn't, it doesn't,

Wishes and what they really want because if you build it exactly how they want and you can explain like, Hey, this is what I can do for you versus, you know, I just can't do this kind of deal, I think comes off better.

TJ: You do a little bit of everything. We've talked about family, we've talked about the fire service, we've talked about leather, working in entrepreneurship. You're also the man who gave me the sled push ladder that almost made me throw up. 

Nick: You're welcome. 

TJ: What does your physical training look like these days with two little ones and a business and changes on the job?

Nick: Yeah. Not good. We have a, the Peloton bike upstairs that. Really that keeps us going home and that's good for at home. 20 minutes is uh, at work, we're fortunate enough to have together and do things and that keeps, you know, a nice throughout the whole day. But as far as something that's actually structured, not currently, like we said, it's, it's, we're in survival mode at, at this point.

But the nice thing is, yeah, we have to go back to that. I was gonna say that like I bank, if you will, if you look at it like a bank account, I haven't stopped movement since I was like 12 years old and I'm 36 now, thankfully that that's paying dividend currently.

TJ: And you hit exactly on what I was going to say and is that our seasons of life are going to always throw curve balls at us. But at least when it comes to fitness, if you've built that engine, if you've built that bank. The hit can be a lot less painful.

Nick: Yeah. And you know, like we said, we're, we're in the survival note. It's just part of life between, we said that before, that's something's gonna, you know, physical, it's something that's the back burner, but I'm not sitting there running periodization table or percentages I need to hit. It's more so like, all right I move today.

I, you know, deposit in the bank, if you will. I'm trying not to eat like, an unreasonable person. I'm trying to eat like that helps, you know, keep, keep things off and keep things where they should be.

TJ: Yeah. Yeah. It's, um, it's a time management. It's those systems that, that we put into play and also being. Being kind to yourself and recognizing that for the time being, we just have to rely on those deposits that we made in the past and then eventually we can get back to making more deposits. But for now, it's just, it's that survival mode.

Nick: Getting the basic needs here, Matt, like that's a huge issue, four to five hours if we're lucky at each night, right? Like there's nothing that's gonna be really been throughout day. If I were to wear an Apple watch or a whoop to see what my recovery is, it'd be nap. Like don't do anything kind of deal.

How does that affect your mental health, your mental stamina, if you will?

You, I feel like after a while you can feel when you're getting frustrated and then you just kind of have to take a breath. Like you can't get angry with. The kids. They're kids. They don't know any better. If you follow up, you know, I've always noticed it happening. I'm like, all right, just time out for a second.

Recognize that it's happening well before it comes, before it comes out. And I, I, you know, you just look at your partner, like, look at my wife all the time. We just laugh. We're like, yeah, they're just, my daughter day looked at me. She's like, dad, you're boring. 

TJ: I was like, what? 

Nick: I, like, I took you tell me I'm boring.

Like, all right. You know, they're just, they're kids. They're brutally honest, man. But they're fun. I don't know. I, I feel, I feel good. I do, I really do. Uh, we're just keep your perspective into the things that you can see changed and, you know, making an effect there.

TJ: Fucking kids are ruthless, bro. 

Nick: Dude, we were at the aquarium. Dad, you're born. I said Ila, so you gonna have fun today? I guess you're all right. Sorry. Thanks. Like

TJ: you are like, listen here, child, 

Nick: have you heard 

TJ: of 

Nick: mines? 

TJ: Of mining? N pa? I'm sending it to 

Nick: a mine, man. I had to, I had to cover my mouth. I did start laughing, laughing. It was just off the cuff. It was so good. 

TJ: That's one thing that I admire about you, is you are very, you are very steadfast in how you handle things.

We've chatted through throughout life, throughout crazy periods and fun periods, and every time that I'm like, Ooh, he's gonna, he's gonna crack, he's gonna show me a break. You're just always even keeled. You are just rolling with the punches, and I think that's, that's something worth imitating. I really, I'm really appreciative of that, how you, you can be that that steady sounding board that I can be like, Nick, I'm about to go berserk.

And you're like, yeah, I just kind of like laugh it off and kind of try to look at the good and I'm like, you know what? Fuck you. You're right. 

Nick: Well, that's true. Like, you know, we all are guilty of it. It's like we complain about things and it's like, all right, what are you gonna do to fix it? Can fix it, and you're not fixing it.

Fix it. And that'll, that'll solve an issue. But if there's nothing you can do about it, why are you gonna let it burden you? You know, if it's outta your hands, it's outta your hands.

TJ: Speaking of Firehouse, you've been around firehouses for a bit. You've been around a block a time or two. Looking back on your fire service career, what does being a good firefighter mean to you?

Nick: I think just, doing the right thing. Like at the end of the day, doing the right thing, making sure those things are done correctly. Check your rig, make sure your stuff's good. You know, looking out for the people that, on just having a sense of accountability for yourself, I guess, really. I, I think that's, I think that really goes a long way.

What about being a good man? What does that mean to you? A good man? Whew.

That same kind of pull, that same thread of just standing up for what's right. Standing up for what you believe in, standing on your morals when even, you know, no one would know that you, slipped or whatever like that, that you, you know. Somewhere just, and if you say you're, if you say that's how you think or how you feel about something that you, you know, you, you, you hold steadfast to it.

You know, you're, you're trustworthy. ' cause then when you speak about something, people are gonna know that you're serious and that you follow through. It's

TJ: go back in time to a younger, more hotheaded. Nick, what part of that younger self are you grateful for that got you here? Ooh, man.

Nick: I think just being ignorant to the fact that I will, like, just, that wasn't even a thought in my head. Just, I don't know if it was confidence or probably a little bit. Two, I'd say. But just, you know, what I wanted to do in life, I knew, knew that in one way or another, how gonna happen

and just being a go, go, go until you, you finally. I think that's, that's really what, what got me to, to where I'm at.

TJ: I love it. I, we're kind of switching gears real fast here because this is something that I did with Bobby. I, um, I picked up my old fireman ship days 2019 notebook where I took all the notes from all the classes and I just basically hid Bobby with all the shit that he had said. And I'm like, gimme more info on this.

Gimme your, your thoughts on it. So let's do that quick lightning round. In your mind, what do firefighters struggle with the most?

Nick: Not putting enough, not putting enough, enough emphasis on the basis. I think when you first too many things, when in reality if you narrow things down a little bit, what, what your job's gonna be. It makes things easier to digest. Who just started two days ago and I've had it for two tours and he's like, I'm like, Hey, look, that's really good. Like, I'm glad you wanna start learning the area, but rather you be really home when you're stretching, how you're pulling it, how you're masking up, and, handling that versus the addresses.

Like, I'll, we'll take care of the addresses, don't worry about about that, but I need you to be on as far as what line's going, how it's going. And how you're gonna mask on when, when it's time to go.

TJ: So the basics, you can't answer the basics of this next one. The fire service needs more blank

Nick: communication. True communication. If you have a problem, don't backdoor people. Go talk to 'em. Don't do it in the open. Do it in a, you know, a closed door area and just come at 'em like a gentleman. If you have a, if you have an issue, and that could be for personnel, for tactical, whatever way you wanna look at it.

If you pull somebody aside, they're on a, on a problem. Or why we do certain things, like get a lot further. You know, you catch a lot more flies with honey than salt. I thought it was veno, something like that. I don't know. 

TJ: We catch flights 

Nick: with shit. Words are hard. 

TJ: How are they attracted to 

Nick: shit? 

TJ: Good.

Perfect. Because I want to know what the thing that nobody talks about is

Nick: in the firefighter service. 

TJ: Yeah. 

Nick: Thing that nobody talks about. Man. 

TJ: Like you could thano snap your fingers and either get rid of one thing or bring it to the forefront. What is it that you're like, yeah, this, this would make the fire service better. 

There was a post about that I made about ladders, about basically needing more training. If you can't handle an extension ladder now, I purposefully say an extension ladder because that could apply to 24 or 28 or 35 or whatever else. And my God, the comments like it was, it is still pandemonium in there.

It is still a bloodbath. There's people just shitting on each other. There's people saying, I can, I can throw, there was a guy that said like, don't ever stop until you can double fist 35 foot ladders. And then somebody's like, hell yeah man. I can't wait to do that. Like, dude, it was just, I love these tiny little arguments.

You, you, that's such a fun part of the fire service. You can just drop that tiny little hand grenade. That you can crap correctly and then just people blow up on each other again over something that's, we have no control. I remember catching shit from people being like, oh man, you drive a clean cab engine.

Yep. If it were me, I'm like, what would you do? Like, what am I supposed to just, I can't buy a new fire engine. I don't have that money. The department bought it. What the fuck am I supposed to do? I just, yeah, I just have to deal with the shit that they gave me. Ta-da. 

Nick: Oh, that's what I said before about like, you know, we run the, we, the driver engine has smooth boards on it at 50 pounds.

The line kicks very easily and we don't have a lot of staffing to go back and, but I'm like, all right, we're just gonna run the, run 'em hot. I was like, but now you're gonna lose the ability to have that back. 'cause you know, I really enjoyed operating elk, our chiefs, that 75 u firmer line. And if you had less manpower.

You had less of an opportunity to, to have a kinky issue. But that again, that's another like rabbit hole. That was the only thing you could think of because you know, go off about it. And I was like, they really both ways. Whatever. Whatever you have on there,

TJ: if you don't have this thing dialed in, nothing else matters either in the fire service or life. What is it?

Nick: Home life. Family's not dialed in, like I said before. That's your foundation if you're having troubles at home, that's getting to everything else very quickly.

TJ: And the one question that I didn't give you, what's the one failure that you cherish the most? 

Nick: Cherish the most?

Ooh, April last year. Backup, it would've been 2023. We run out House Fire, 200 block Margate Road four lit out as two kids trapped upstairs. I was the OV that night. Got in, I found them like for us that night. Fast forward the following year, driving houses up for literally the exact same call I put my shirt that we have, like, uh, the polos that we wear.

And for some reason that night I put my polo over top of tool that's right in there that I use. I'm going up to VES, I throw, throw my ladder, and I crap. I, I literally forgot my tool. ' cause my shirt's hanging on it and I've never done that before. Setting your stuff up the exact same way every time.

Pivots like, don't alter it. Always going that way. Have it done that way. Always do it that way. Now, that day at favor, there was nobody home. God forbid if there was, I'd be replaying that 10 seconds it took me to go back to the rig, to grab a tool

to get into that window quicker. Like it's just the little things, man. Just that small failure of putting my shirt over what I've never do. For some reason I did that day and it just cost me, so lay it out the same way. Never change.

TJ: It seems like a perfect way to end it. Nick, thank you so much for your time and for being here today again.

Nick: No problem, my brother. It's good to see you. 

TJ: Likewise.